THIS IS THE ONLY REVIEW OF MALLORY’S BOOK YOU NEED EVER READ.
Little-known facts about “Jack and Diane,” the protagonists of THE WORST SONG EVER WRITTEN:
Jack’s grandparents helped them buy a house, so now they both have to look the other way when Grampy Jerry gets racist.
Jack gained 30 pounds in the first year of their marriage. Diane blames the chilli dogs at the Tastee Freeze. Jack asked her to “lay off” about the dogs, and said Linda from work sometimes comes down to the Freeze and eats burgers with the boys and everything.
Jack briefly considered starting an affair with Linda, but couldn’t work up the nerve to try.
People I trust and respect are all up my ass to listen to “Serial,” so you can make your case at the current time.
spoiler: they couldn’t, bc of the unexamined white supremacy that underwrites our nation no matter how many sweater vests you buy your kids!
My wife and I, both African Americans, constitute one of those Type A couples with Ivy League undergraduate and graduate degrees who, for many years, believed that if we worked hard and maintained great jobs, we could insulate our children from the blatant manifestations of bigotry that we experienced as children in the 1960s and ’70s.
I do not have a Spotify and do not even know if you say “a Spotify” but this treasure compiled my Benedict playlist for y’all to listen to. I did not need it, as every one of those songs is livin’ large on my iTunes account.
OH, I’m pretty into Gotham, and would like to talk about it.
Three words: Lady. Fight. Club.
Why hasn’t anyone at the New York Times seen Good Burger?
The complaint reveals that a clear, official attempt was made to address Mr. Ghomeshi’s behaviour in the workplace, and it was reviewed and acknowledged by CBC managers long before the star host was fired last month. Sources said they felt management was sympathetic, but that Mr. Ghomeshi’s office conduct never significantly changed.
“Just the fact that we had to present [the proposals] in this way speaks to the culture of fear – that these things weren’t things that we felt we could address on an ongoing basis,” said a staffer who was involved in drafting the proposals.
this is great and a nice co-read with the unassisted childbirth stuff from the other day, bc girl if you have not moved past 3 cm and you’ve been having contractions every three minutes for over a day you just do what you gotta do, I want to HUG YOU:
I wished for a way to communicate pain more precisely than a scale of 1 to 10. But the scale is subjective, I longed to say. We have no way to know. I hated this. I said 7, 8. I didn’t know. It was the worst pain I’ve ever felt, but I have never had my arm cut off. That was what I always imagine to be the worst pain: having a limb chopped off. I saved 10 for it, out of respect. I wanted to save 9 for the moment the baby tears its way out of my vagina. So what’s left is 8. I wanted to seem brave, so I said 7, but then I worried they wouldn’t understand the immediacy of the situation, so I came back with 8. I shrugged. I tried to communicate in a gesture that I didn’t agree with their method, with these yellow emoticons, with the Spanish above it. DOLOR. I stared at this sign so much, waiting for some answer to come from it. MUY DOLOROSO.
Started listening to Serial after Julie Klausner described it positively on Twitter as “True Crime plus BALTIMORE ACCENTS.” She’s right, and it’s great.
Oh my god, are there really Baltimore accents? I’m a native New Yorker but have been in Baltimore for about 8 years now, and I didn’t even notice the accents. So obviously I’ve become accustomed to them.
YES the accents, I love them. I worked at a construction company in Glen Burnie for a while, and I miss those accents so hard.
Weirdly, the mother of one of my middle school best friends worked at Woodlawn High School when all this went down. But I never heard about any of it until Serial!
I listened to all of it yesterday afternoon while I did stuff, and I like, have never really listened to podcasts before, but I was INTO IT.
I spent some formative years in suburban Bawlimer and any hesitations I had about listening were completely gone once I found out that was the setting! I totally remember the integral snowstorm they discuss, which makes everything creepier?
So Jack and Dianne basically became the Lisa and Ralph nightmare sequence.
“Wesley, get mama’s pryin’ bar.”
best. episode. ever.
I’m just glad someone else sees that song for the execrable piece of crap that it is. That that person is Nicole is just the very sweet icing on the cake.
(Seriously, you guys, if you were not around in the early 80s, you just don’t understand. That song was HUGE and it played on Top 40 radio like every 20 min. and there was no escaping it because there was no Spotify or iTunes or Pandora. We’re all still traumatized, 30 years later.)
And every single time you went to the skating rink, they played it.
In some distant corner of my brain, “Jack & Diane” got mixed up with JCM’s also ubiquitous “Hurt So Good,” so in the unconscious narrative my tween brain constructed about the former, Jack and Diane engage in some naive, not-well-negotiated BDSM as an unintended mechanism to work out their frustrations with each other.
After Mindy Kaling challenged people to write new lyrics about Nguyen and Ari (https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/692892-as-it-is-i-guess-i-find-jack-and-diane) I wrote one.
It is…a bit long. But I’ll post it here if anyone’s interested! I’m kind of proud of it! I just don’t want to dump all my lyrics on you!
Eh, I’ll post it.You’re welcome/I’m sorry.
In Mindy Kaling’s book, she writes: “I wish there was a song called “Nguyen and Ari”, a little ditty about a hardworking Vietnamese girl who helps her parents with the franchised Holiday Inn they run, and does homework in the lobby, and Ari, a hardworking Jewish boy who does volunteer work at his grandmother’s old-age home, and the they after school at the Princeton Review…”
“Jack and Diane” is actually a really short song! I was not able to shoehorn in the old age home or TPR. But I think I’ve stayed true to the nature of Kaling’s character sketch.
Little ditty about Nguyen and Ari
Two American kids studying for the SAT
Nguyen’s gonna be a material engineer
Ari isn’t decided yet, might be Psych or Shakespeare
Sitting under fluorescent lights at her parents’ Holiday Inn
Doing homework on the side while helping customers check in
Ari says, “Hey Nguyen, let’s just imagine next year,
All this hard work pays off and we’re really there”
And say a
“Oh yeah, life starts soon
Leaving for college like steppin onto the moon
Oh yeah, life starts soon
Leaving for college like steppin onto the moon, now rock on”
Ari sits back reflects his thoughts for the moment
Scratches his head and does his best James Kirk
Well, you know Nguyen, you look lovely in the moonlight
Nguyen says, “Baby, we’re in a fluorescent room”
Ari say a
“Oh yeah, life starts soon
Leaving for college like steppin onto the moon
Oh yeah, life starts soon
Leaving for college like steppin onto the moon.
Gonna let it rock
Let it roll
See a future out there
Go try out new roles
Work hard at 16, so that you can
Grow up into
Women and men
Oh yeah, life starts soon
Leaving for college like steppin onto the moon
Oh yeah, life starts soon
Leaving for college like steppin onto the moon
A little ditty about Nguyen and Ari
Two American kids studying for the SAT
Tangentially, this just reminded me of Mallory pointing out that even in Lisa’s worst case scenarios, Milhouse just never crosses her mind.
That LA Review of Books is indeed a thing of absolute beauty. Goddamn I’m glad that people are recognizing the Toast and its fantastic editors and the larger feminist blogosphere for what it is.
ALSO I read this article the other day and it basically crushed me. http://www.cbc.ca/news/multimedia/nunavut-put-com… It’s so, so, so sad and so frustrating and in some ways reminds me a lot of the Ghomeshi story because why didn’t anyone DO anything when there was so, so, so much evidence? Why? It’s awful and heartbreaking and yet incredibly important–why does no one want to be The Bad Guy when the ACTUAL bad guy is out there DOING THE BAD SHIT?
Jesus.
That article is devastating in so many ways and now I want to visit a certain nurse in Thunder Bay and shake her by the shoulders until she’s liquified.
Here is a Toronto Life piece profiling people who get massive money handouts from their parents.
Here is a Toronto Life piece profiling people who live on minimum wage.
A lot of the comments on the first one are along the lines of “Damn entitled yuppies who let mom and dad pay their mortgage because they insist on a detached Victorian townhouse in a neighbourhood they can’t afford, your kids don’t need to go to private school or take music lessons” etc.
A lot of the comments on the second one are along the lines of “Stupid poor people who can’t figure out they’d save money by packing their lunches instead of eating out, you don’t need a cellphone” etc.
What does it take to earn the sympathy of the average Toronto Life reader??
And why do I keep reading Toronto Life??
The moral of neoliberal individualism is: you’re always doing it wrong. 🙁
“Everyone is stupid except MEEEEE!”
You must live an average middle-class life without any boosts from your family or school, earn your way through university without touching any debt, obtain an average job and spouse and two children, rent a modest apartment or home in the outskirts of the GTA and then have some really tragic and out-of-the-blue befall you. Like a meteor strike on your house or something. Then and only then will the readers of TL feel sympathy for you–because you did everything right and didn’t suck off the taxpayer teat, and it was literally something from outer space that could not have been foreseen.
And even then people will gripe at you for renting instead of owning because THAT’S IRRESPONSIBLE. But if you complain about not being able to buy a home then you’re entitled. See? EASY.
But then Mike Holmes will come fix your house because it’s such a sad story!
(Is it obvious that my knowledge of Canada comes mostly from HGTV shows?)
God, I’m not going to lie, I love Mike Holmes so, so, so so much. I really lobbied hard for him to come and inspect our house (like three hours from Toronto) but got vetoed cause it’s like four times as much as a normal inspection. My cries of “But it’s a HOLMES INSPECTION” fell on deaf ears.
Mike Holmes is a goddamned national treasure. Mike Holmes needs to be the official North American designated post-tragedy comforter.
….with a side of comforting from Damon Bennett.
I require something more robust that comforting from Damon.
Mm-hmm…
People who look down on renters while struggling to make mortgage payments that are easily twice what the rent would be on a comparable property are so darkly, tragically hilarious to me. Enjoy being house-poor for decades, only to see the real-estate bubble burst and your dream of selling the house for a massive profit die a sudden death, I guess?
I remember an article in… the G&M, I think, that profiled a middle-aged woman in Vancouver who explained that she could have bought a condo when she was in her 20s, but she chose not to because the flexibility of renting gave her the freedom to travel the world and the financial leeway to open her own business. 99% of the comments were like “YOU’RE SUCH A DUMBASS, if you’d bought a condo you could be selling it off now for 3 times what you paid for it! Fuck the fulfillment of your ambition and your hopes and dreams! YOU COULD HAVE BEEN A HOMEOWNER INSTEAD.”
I am 28 years old and I actually get more pressure to buy a home than I do to have a child.
It’s because of SELFISH MILLENNIALS like us that the economy has gotten so bad! If only we would go out there and buy houses and cars and vacation timeshares, this ship would right itself again.
WE CAN’T BUY REAL ESTATE WE SPEND ALL OUR MONEY ON CANDY CRUSH.
My husband and I now own a house and every time I encounter someone who’s smugly going “Millenials don’t care about things like houses! They can’t afford them because BLAH” I enjoy telling them about THE HOUSE WE OWN. Then they go “Uh uh well you’re not like those other people I was talking about” and YOU BET I AM, DICKHEAD.
Goodness, you’re a Millenial? This is rather shameful to admit because, as a Gen X’er, I found myself cultivating a “get off my lawn” attitude towards anyone born in the 80’s (largely due to the collective chronic misspelling of “loose” vs. “lose” and the obsession with social media which, as I now type this, are rather poor reasons for dismissing an entire generation of young people) and when I read anything by a commentator that’s dry, funny, insightful AND uses correct spelling, punctuation, etc. I automatically think “Ah, someone in their 30’s/40’s”. Long story short: Thank you for giving me a much needed attitude adjustment, God knows it’s overdue.
Well, not only that, but I get the impression that many many many Toasties are Millennials as well. There are lots of us and while some of us are idiots, that is true of every single generation.
And yes, I’m 26.
(The oldest Millennials are now in their 30s, so you might not be strictly wrong with the age thing there.)
Oh god, I live in a city with skyrocketing housing prices and at least once a week I get trapped in a conversation about real estate and how I ought to buy my apartment before I get priced out. I’m 25 and the pressure to have a child is way out on the horizon but the homeownership pressure showed up waaay sooner than I expected.
Me too — from my brother of all people. He says he doesn’t feel comfortable visiting me unless I buy a house big enough that I can host his 4-person family in it instead of doing what I usually do — put them up on my own dime in a nice b&b in walking distance of my place. The b&b is seriously nice, they’ve never complained about that, he just says it’s not the same as staying with me. It is creating huge tension for us. Does this crazy dynamic make sense to any of you — can you explain it for me?
For the record, I live in an area where even dinky houses start around 1.2 million USD, whereas he lives in an area where houses start around 300,000USD. My husband and I pay a buttload of money for our 2BR apartment rental, but it is just not big enough to fit his family unless we had wall-to-wall sleeping bags in the living room and then there would be nowhere to sit and talk… it just wouldn’t work out very happily.
You put him up on YOUR dime and he is complaining? Yeah, I cannot explain this. This is bananas.
I do like staying with family when visiting – makes for a cozy old family home vibe. But it’s only fun when there’s a comfy bed in a private room available for me – otherwise it’s totally worth breaking up the slumber party for a hotel. It’s especially nice that you pay for the B&B! Your brother is just being a tool. Tell him if he’s got $3m for you to buy a house with, you’d be happy to, but otherwise, he can shut his trap.
YOU pay for him to visit? That is … exceedingly generous. Too generous, I would venture to say, especially considering his ungrateful attitude. And no, his complaints make absolutely no sense to me AT ALL. If you had the room, sure maybe his family could stay with you, but asking you making major life choices/commitments for the sake of HIS family’s convenience when they come to visit? Is insane and incredibly entitled.
When my sister comes to visit, she sleeps on my shitty futon in the middle of my living room, with my deranged cats alternately snuggling up to her, licking her fingertips and nose, or screaming their damn fool heads off. This suits her just fine.
His basic response is to not come visiting at all because he can’t stay with me in the house, which is… sad. I don’t get to see a lot of my niece and nephew, though I do make the trek out to seem him at his place from time to time.
Thanks for the support! Most of the rest of our family has passed away so we really are each other’s family, which is why I make a big effort to make this work, and probably still will, though it is increasingly driving me nuts.
You are a lovely person and a very kind and generous sibling. I apologize if I was overly harsh towards your brother; I know how important (and infuriating!) family can be.
Family that won’t come visit because you won’t spend six to seven figures to create for them their own, private hotel are family that can damn well wait ’till a wedding or a funeral.
Sounds like a losing battle hosting him anyway, even if you got the house imagine the shit you’d get because the bedsheets are not made out of woven gold
Thank you! I get this so much and it drives me crazy. I like quoting Shiller http://www.citylab.com/housing/2013/10/economist-….
And also mentioning that post-war home ownership was basically designed to make people conservative government drones (which I don’t necessary believe to be true for everyone) but makes me sound the right amount of snotty.
Oooh, thank you!
Owning is terrible. And I say this as someone who owns something awesome, and is good at fixing the parts (most of them anyway) that break. Y’all keep renting! Move to another town whenever you like! Call someone else to fix the dishwasher! Walk away if the lot next door turns into an all night catfish restaurant and car lot!
Seconded.
After watching my parents buy their house, promptly lose a battle to keep everything they’d ever saved and then some from being devoured by carpenter ants, and wind up stranded for the rest of their lives on a pile of ant shit in a depressing helltown, I wouldn’t buy real estate if I had Carnegie money.
That my total actual savings come out to like $6k is just blessed happenstance
We are on month sixteen of fighting termites. On the second floor of a brick building. Insects are most likely the worst.
My boyfriend owns a condo. I rent. We want to move in together, but his place is too small and too far from my job. Because he owns it, he has to deal with all of the repairs and work to make it either sellable or rentable to someone else. I just have to give my landlord notice and pack my shit. I fail to see the ways in which owning is superior.
I read that minimum wage one yesterday, but on my phone, so the comments wouldn’t load! It was pretty much the best technical error ever.
Toronto Life: officially the worst on class-issues. I really feel like they can’t understand that people who make less than $120,000 a year and own property read their magazine. Or they’re just selling aspiration.
Toronto Life and BlogTo commentators are also … um, pretty lacking in compassion.
If you wanted sympathy, you should have had the foresight to be born prior to 1980 so that all of your schooling was finished and you already were locked into a non-balloon 30 year mortgage before the 2008 crash like a responsible person.
Toronto LIfe, BlogTO, some of the worst commenters on the entire internet, y/n?
Serial is great, especially if you like crime stories, but people are making me crazy with their “Will it have a satisfying ending??” NO IT WILL NOT. I am 100% confident that Sarah Koenig will not prove this guy innocent and get him sprung from prison. Even if the first part is possible, the second is a much bigger hurdle. And if she proves him guilty, well, we’ve spent all this time getting to know him, and that would basically be a bummer.
I’m still all in.
I’m hoping that with the events of the 7th episode (trying to be vague to avoid spoilers), there’s a higher chance of at least getting something better for this guy. Because they actually know what they’re doing and have the pull to make something happen.
Yup! Turning point I think.
Oh yeah, I haven’t heard it yet, but that sounds promising…
But weren’t all of these episodes based on interviews recorded months ago? Like, if Adnan were freed because of the work Serial did months ago it would be a front-page news story TODAY.
But it would likely take closer to years to get this case far enough along that Adnan is free. [possible spoilers] Also, I know from the Serial Reddit thread that Adnan has filed another appeal recently, so presumably things are in motion.
NICOLE. SERIAL. Because (spoiler alert but not really it doesn’t tell you anything) in the latest episode a whole crack team of expert defense lawyers gets on the case and if they make a difference we’ll all have been privy to the process of saving someone from life in prison. Also it’s a very intriguing mystery and WHY THE HELL CAN’T ANYONE ACCOUNT FOR THAT FUCKING PHONE BOOTH IN FRONT OF BEST BUY YOU GUYS.
I love the new addition of the crack team of lawyers and did anyone else imagine it was the kids from How to Get Away with Murder sifting through all the files?
That’s exactly what I was picturing! The FBI Republican kid Sarah spoke with is totally Asher.
I re-listen to the whole series after each new episode to keep it all fresh. I have a long commut and it’s TRUE CRIME. Currently I’m in the camp that Adnon and Jay were in cahoots. Jay ratted out Adnon to save himself, but, in my opinion, the case we have heard should not have been enough to get a conviction.
And that makes me more mad than anything. Violence against should be punished, but the proof should be beyond reasonable doubt. Hae isn’t here to tell us what happened, so what do we do?
Serial, man.
And don’t even get me started on the moral ambiguity of the very premise of the show. Ugh.
If it were Jay and Adnan in it together, why wouldn’t Adnan have just said that when it looked like he was going to get convicted and try to put more of the blame back on Jay? Like I feel like if Adnan did it, he would have gone to more effort to have a cover story or someone else to pin it on. His lack of explanations/memories/alibi for that day seem to be a result of being innocent.
YES this is my (current) working theory as well. Or, well, that I think Adnan did do it, and that Jay’s lies and evasions were more about covering up the amount of complicity/involvement he had in covering up the murder, not because he’s secretly the REAL KILLERRR (*dun dun dunnnn*), as much as I wish that were the case. AND YET I would still classify this as a failure of the criminal justice system, because the evidence is so flimsy that I just can’t see how it possibly, truly, met the standard of beyond reasonable doubt. And it’s all so inflected with Islamophobia and inadequate representation, it truly is a miscarriage of justice in my mind, EVEN IF he did do it…?
And yessss let’s all talk about the weird ethical tangle that is this show and (*mild spoiler*) Sarah being given the decision to involve/not involve in Innocence Project peeps?! It must be that, at a minimum, Adnan was consulted off-record, but why wasn’t that teased out more?! The most recent episode made it sound like it was solely Sarah’s decision.
Also also – WHY do I wish it were Jay and not Adnan?! Because Adnan is the protagonist of this story (and also because I have an investment revealing the injustices of the criminal justice system), which further raises questions about the ethics of the whole thing. Why should I root for Jay to be the bad guy and not Adnan? Grossss, self!
So sorry. I have been trapped in a conference all day.
Big spoiler ahead.
There was a great comment on Serial’s facebook page after ep6 which I think explains one possibility pretty well: “It’s been suggested that this is the classic Prisoner’s Dilemma. They both were involved in the murder, and neither can rat out the other. If only the two of them knew the details about the murder, then both would be in the clear, assuming that neither talks. Only the problem for Adnan is that Jenn knew. She’s the key piece here, because she knows more than she told police. Again, because if she admits to knowing more, now she becomes an accessory. So she gives just enough to implicate Adnan, not enough to really implicate Jay, and nothing that fully implicates herself. I’m thoroughly convinced that the mystery call that Adnan gets when at Kathy’s house is Jenn calling Adnan and telling he and Jay to pull it together and get rid of the body. Now, once Jay started talking to police, that put Adnan in an extremely weak position as the ex-boyfriend. His best option was to claim that he was not involved at all, rather than admitting SOME involvement. Remember, by admitting nothing, a decent defense attorney probably could have raised enough reasonable doubt in the jury to get an acquittal because the state’s case was full of holes. Unfortunately, as we will probably find out, his legal counsel was not able to take advantage of it. Even after being convicted, his best chance at securing any kind of appeal is to claim he had no involvement in Hae’s murder at all, rather than pin Jay and claim he only had some involvement (because he would still be an accessory and not really exonerated). If neither side admits to actually killing Hae, then without forensic evidence you have a very weak case. What motive does Jay have for killing Hae? None. But with Adnon, there is a motive. A strong motive that can be backed up with circumstantial evidence that supports it, assuming you don’t look too hard. The state caught a huge break in that the defense couldn’t poke enough holes in the story to create enough reasonable doubt.”
Ah! Very interesting theory! I spent an hour on the Serial subreddit last night, I’m so ashameddddd (and fascinated).
Because there was no call from Best Buy, I gather.
Also I’m beginning to think it was Dana. A “shrimp sale at the Crab Crib” indeed, Dana.
Yes, excellent misdirection there by Dana.
I think it was the MailKimp myself.
okay, I literally LOLd
There’s talk of a Crab Crib tshirt. Not gonna lie: I’d totally buy one, especially if the proceeds were donated to the Innocence Project or the show.
I really wish we would get an episode about the defense attorney and her ethics or lack thereof. She sounds like a really terrible person, I remember in one of the early episodes Sarah said she would tank cases on purpose just to get paid to work the appeals also. Shame she passed away but she must have had some assistants that are still with us.
I’m also obsessed with Serial and will talk about it with anyone and everyone who is willing. This youtube video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=stYkaBFpDyc&f… is the funniest response to the issue of the best buy phone booth and I highly recommend it.
Every time they talk about the Best Buy parking lot, I lose it and start giggling. No idea why. I think it’s just the idea of one of the most mundane places in the whole world being the alleged location of a gruesome murder just doesn’t compute and turns to giggles. Also, I always get this song in my head except I substitute “Whole Foods” with “Best Buy”: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2UFc1pr2yUU
I keep reading things about Serial but being in the UK, have never seen or really heard of the thing it’s a spinoff from. Will that matter?
No. I’ve never heard This American Life. Serial stands alone.
Nope! This American Life does a lot of short- (or, really medium-) form memoir, interviews and essays in an audio format. It wouldn’t be that weird if they had taken this particular story and made a single one-hour episode out of (part of) it. But the episodes of TAL are all discrete entities telling (mostly) non-fiction, so you don’t need to know a single thing prior to episode I of Serial.
You might benefit a little from having some familiarity with the US criminal justice system, but that’s absolutely not a necessity.
Marvellous, thankyou both! I will get onto it after my history Rex Factor binge.
Related: don’t be fooled by the show’s title, This American Life is pretty generally great even if you are not American (I am Canadian). I mean, occasionally there’s an episode where they talk about stuff that heavily involves say, the Constitution or US immigration laws or something else removed from direct impact on my life, but it’s still so well done that I am interested anyway.
They did a whole hour about the history of the euro and the ensuing Greek financial crisis and done by anyone else I would have been like UGH MONEY IS SO BORING but in fact it was one of the most fascinating things I’ve ever listened to.
GOTHAM. YES. Loving every second of it.
Sidebar, did you see that the lovely young man (J.W. Cortes) who plays Officer Alvarez was on Humans of New York, twice?
I can’t figure out how to embed the damn link to the post, but he’s there, on Nov 3.
That review by Sarah Mesle was fucking amazing because it made me love Mallory’s writing even more which I DID NOT THINK WAS EVEN POSSIBLE.
OMG, YES! Thank you for expressing my exact feelings, too! Such a glorious review in every possible way.
I know, I was kvelling over how perfectly it articulates the genius of Mallory’s writing and does such an amazing critical review of the gender implications of the book…and then I went to the comments. NO MATTER HOW CAREFULLY you pose it, discussions of gender inequality are met with the SAME tiring response from internet men, over and over and OVER. Which, on the bright side, only underscores why Mallory’s book is so important and brilliant!
A (straight white male) friend posted this beautiful review on Facebook, saying something like, “Ortberg’s writing makes me tired, but this review helps me appreciate why some people love it.”
It isn’t FOR you, straight white man. Mallory has said this a zillion times. If you and your straight white man friends like it, that’s cool, but you are not the Toast’s target audience.
It was such a lovely review.
My straight white man pestered me all yesterday until I read the LARB piece (he writes for them sometimes too & is internet-pals with Mesle) because he so gets why I love Mallory. I suspect spending as much time working with undergraduates as he does helps to tip the scales. (If, you know, being married to me for decades doesn’t do the trick.)
Oh, yes, my own personal straight white man, who is married to me, cannot understand why anyone wouldn’t love a piece of Mallory’s writing. He is a dear, I’ll keep him.
ITT we discuss the greatest and most inclusive song ever, We’re All Dudes
I’M A DUDE
HE’S A DUDE
SHE’S A DUDE
‘CUZ WE’RE ALL DUDES
HEY!
Seriously, the NYT needs to get on Netflix and watch this treasure of a movie. I don’t care how nostalgia-fueled or bad it subjectively is, it’s great and you will rip it from my cold dead hands (much like Snakes on a Plane)
I re-watched it not too long ago and thought it was genuinely awesome, but then I was pretty drunk at the time.
Also, while we’re on links, I’m just gonna leave this here:
“Too Many Cooks” http://youtu.be/RzdRQCnDBlw
Beat me to it. Amazing.
I just watched all eleven and a half minutes of this and now I will never view reality in the same way again.
Oh my god. My husband showed me this last night and I was coming off a Vicodin and I felt like I was having a fever dream. Alan Sepinwall tweeted this morning that he woke up and found that the memory of every song he had ever heard had been obliterated by the “Too Many Cooks” theme. I am right there with him.
Gotham!! I feel like it’s a spiritual cousin of the 1960’s Adam West Batman show. So campy! Little Oswald, with his hair like an unkempt penguin’s hair! FISH MOONEY, who is as fully realized as if she had decades of comic book canon behind her. Precious righteous Jim Gordon with his muscles in his shirt. How I love them all!
My girlfriend and I have taken to heckling Bruce (aka CRY MORE, TINY BATMAN) from our couch every time he’s on screen. It just makes everything better, somehow.
Sad baby-Goth Mini-Batman DRAWING ANGSTILY while listening to LOUD MUSIC is still the best scene the show has offered, thus far.
Thank you for this suggestion; it will certainly improve my Gotham experience.
Ben McKenzie as precious righteous Jim Gordon gives me super intense nostalgia for The OC, which is great.
My favourite thing about Gotham is the non-specific semi-recent-past time setting though. 80s/90s cars! Flip phones! Fish Mooney’s very current platform heels!
The last three paragraphs of that review are amazing and I can’t decide if I want a poster or just to tattoo them on my back. YES. SRSLY.
Yes, sister yehhessssssss
“I turn to Ortberg’s work in moments when I have been patted on the head by older men who don’t see it a problem that they will never imagine me as more than a child; when I am told (overtly or implicitly) that whatever I do it will never be as important as what a man does; when yet another male talent is revealed as abusive and the world fails to respond. I turn to Ortberg when I, like her, feel rather proud to wear the “misandrist” mantel. I turn to Ortberg when I want to say to the men I love that “your request of ‘gotta hear both sides’ has been denied.”
This perfectly encapsulates why I proudly wear my misandrist badge and seek out a bit of Ortberg after a shitty day or run-in with the patriarchy. I crave reading it, because seeing it validates what so many women think and feel, myself included, and it feels like sharing a confidence with a friend to read it.
Just be sure to correct their spelling of “mantle” if you decide to go with the tattoo.
Yes I’m here for Good Burger. Also George Clinton being in that movie. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q48x5XrvdC0
Also I know everyone is on the “Paul Rudd never ages” train but can we add Kenan to that?
A+ tabs today, Jaya!
I loved that review. Mallory, when I first started reading you, something clicked, and I realised I do not take men seriously and I do not have to take men seriously and the gentle (sometimes not gentle) derision with which I feel compelled to treat them is a fine and well-considered thing. It was affirming and empowering. I took the piss out of An Important Man the other day and he was just slightly aware of it, enough to know that something was up, but unable to say what. It was great. So….thanks!
I was nodding so vigorously along with that whole review–now I have more specific words for how I felt when I started reading the Toast and realized that it was filling up this big empty space in my life that I didn’t even know was there. I just gchatted to my roommate:
“there’s nothing that makes me feel more powerful than laughing at self important dude bullshit
nothing”
And it’s true.
Haha, all the butthurt dudes in the various comment sections of all the glowing reviews of Mallory’s book, hahaha. Ahh man.
Hahaha, ok, I’m sorry, I’m sorry, I’m done laughing (lies, I’m not sorry and I’ll never be done)
dude you can’t read the comments
i wish they would just let me explain to them the difference between misandry and nature
Sometimes, if I’m going to read the comments, I imagine that they’re being said by Gachnar, Dark Lord of Nightmares and the Bringer of Terror.
Ha ha, did you read the guy on the guardian who was mad because they called The Toast feminist? The Toast isn’t feminist, he says, why did they have to go and bring gender into it.
Wh-what does he think feminism is?
Oh yeah, I saw that juicebox. The Toast itself says “we are feminst” and this guy is like, “no, let me explain that you are in fact not, I am a man who reads you, so you can trust that I know”. Fucking hell, man.
He was pretty good, but my clear favourite is this dude:
“The headline is completely misleading. It suggests that this young lady is a man-hating troll. Reading on though, she is anything but. She seems modest, playful and highly intelligent. It’s not her fault that she was asked loaded questions such as what women writers she would recommend and what advice she has for women writers. Lift your game Guardian”
WHAT IS IT. IS IT EVEN REAL? HOW CAN IT TYPE?
Modest, playful, highly intelligent. I’ve always said so!
“Reader: at moments like this, I would marry her.”
um, the queue is forming BEHIND me.
bring gifts.
and I’d advise against red tights
Somebody send her the Cumberbatch Spotify playlist.
Man, what an excellent link roundup.
1. I read “A Birth Story” in the tinyletter newsletter format, which was a really cool way to read a story like that – as if a friend is sending you a long email telling you something important that has happened to her. It felt more intimate sitting in my inbox than it would have on a website, somehow. And it is beautifully told.
2. I was JUST opening up Link Roundup in one window and the Benedict Cumberbatch article in another window so I could go find the Spotify playlist, and look at this, God bless you, you’ve put it right here and I don’t have to search through the comments!
3. SERIAL IS REALLY WORTH LISTENING TO. Along with everything else that makes it great, I think it’s this totally fascinating portrayal of how people tell stories and how people remember, and how those memories differ. Because, like, (without spoilers) definitely someone is lying, or multiple people are lying. The stories differ too widely for that not to be true. But also, it’s clear that some people are just talking about their memories of an event six weeks ago, or fifteen years ago, and they’re telling the truth and it is different from someone who is also telling the truth.
Ending rambling now. It’s great!
Yes! And it’s so satisfying to see how the producers and we react to it being impossible to fit the messiness of this story into the kind of narrative they’re used to telling and we’re used to consuming. It’s interesting to see that all exposed when there really may be high stakes involved.
Also oh hai look what was in my bed last night.
Simmons College, which is all-women at the undergraduate level, announced this week they are expanding their admissions eligibility to ALL self-identifying women. Awesome!
http://simmons.edu/overview/about/news/community/…
excellent. now Smith (and the others, I just know about Smith cause my sister graduated from there a couple of years ago) need to get on board.
Smith’s president actually sent a letter to all alumnae today saying that they’re in the process of working on the policy, and asked everyone to give an opinion in an open form. Encourage your sister to reply, I certainly did!
I absolutely will be. Thank you very much for letting me know.
I was just coming here to mention this! I am so glad they are finally reaching out to the broader Smith community about this, though I did see one alumna on FB write a sensational comment to the local group along the lines of ‘Smith will be going coed and admitting men! Are there no safe spaces!?’. I love my Smith sisters, but I am also reminded of the serious side-eye a lot of people merited.
That chain on the Smith alum FB group got completely out of hand. There were many comments that made me disappointed in the closed mindedness of some of the alumnae. It’s a complex issue, with a lot to consider, and it took me a really long time to form my opinion. I know that that opinion isn’t perfect, but I also know that I don’t believe that exclusion is the answer.
Lord, I haven’t seen a broader Fb group discussion (thankfully), but I can imagine that being the case. I agree though, it’s taken me a while to think about what the issue means to me, as an alum, and what would be what Sophia Smith would have wanted had she been here to rule on this. It might be deluded, but I think she would have wanted her place of learning to be one that is open and safe to all women, just as it seemed to strive to be when I was there. I understand the reluctance, due to seemingly antiquated ideas, but candidates for women’s colleges have almost always been self-selecting young women; I firmly believe that that is no different for transwomen who would like to attend the school and that they should be allowed to matriculate at Smith.
I’m a Simmons alum & was quite pleased to find that announcement in my email this week.
YEAH THIS IS AWESOME
I want to like Gotham but they will insist on making Gordon’s fiancee a Idiotic Load and I am none too pleased with how they’ve portrayed Montoya so far.
“Spend enough time in this system, as a white dude particularly, and you come to believe in your own gravitas.”
The LARB review is amazing in general but THIS LINE hits exactly the right note. Fuck gravitas.
Yes.
Also “Fuck Gravitas” (or … “Defying Gravitas”) would be an excellent Culture ship name.
It totally would.
I love that!
As an academic who is now a dude, this is my greatest fear. My field is full of evil sexy nuns and giant helmets crushing people and casual conversations with Satan, if you ever catch me with “gravitas” please set me on fire and drop me off a cliff.
Sexy evil nuns? Wh…what field are you in and where do I sign up?
I’m guessing 18th-century novels.
Well-guessed! The giant helmet is from The Castle of Otranto, casual conversations with Satan feature in The Private Memoirs and Confessions of a Justified Sinner (among others), and the sexy evil nun (actually, a sexy evil woman disguised as a monk, but that seemed complicated) is from The Monk. Of these, I most heartily recommend reading The Castle of Otranto, because it has the best bonkers-shit-per-page ratio. The giant helmet is, like, page six.
< / evangelical love of my field >
I recall this from times you have told us about these books.
It was on my desk it was ON MY DESK. The bedbugs have crossed the fucking channel! SEND YOUR CHILDREN TO THE COUNTRYSIDE THE BLITZ HAS BEGUN.
My very type-A boarding school did have a lady fight club! That the dorm parents knew of and encouraged.
The crowning glory of this story is that they called it pillow fight club.
I was also on the “Eh, Serial, I don’t need to listen to even more podcasts nope” bus for a long time, and then I decided to try the second episode (since I’d already heard the first on TAL). ….Yeah, I binged on the entire thing and am now waiting anxiously for next week so I can hear what happens next. It is SO GOOD if you’re into people figuring out what happened in this really weird, messy situation.
Wait, is there a Toast Stance on sweater vests?
To quote the great Demetri Martin, they’re really great for narrow cold fronts?
Man, I love Serial, but if you guys aren’t also listening to Criminal YOU ARE MISSING OUT.
1. It’s also lady run/hosted
2. It’s also about crime
3. But about different aspects of crime
4. Like one episode on a mother/daughter forensic team
5. It’s being added to Radiotopia because they Kickstarted enough
6. You should donate here: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1748303376/r…
7. If they get 20,000 backers they get an extra $25,000 and Criminal can be twice monthly
8. They’re awesome and consciously made an effort to get equal lady representation in the collective
9. PODCASTS, YOU GUYS
OTHER GREAT PODCASTS:
– Hound Tall with Moshe Kasher (I love him, it just started and it’s recordings of live discussions on topics with experts and comedians. Most recently Caitlin Doughty on Death, with Chelsea Peretti and Kumail Nanjani. So great.)
– Professor Blastoff, duh.
– Night Vale, duh-ier.
– What else?
OH MY GOD SO MANY
– Strangers, because that shit gets personal and AMAZING and LEA THAU YOU GUYS
– State of the Re:Union because Al Letson knows what’s up and tells amazing stories about amazing communities
– Risk because duh
– How Did This Get Made because DUH
Al Letson is the absolute best! More SOTRU!
Also:
Snap Judgment (sometimes it gets rocky but overall it’s great)
Nerdette (you all probably already have it but I just found it and I’m in love)
Zorba Paster on Your Health (because I’m an old man at heart)
Has anyone else listened to Chewing the Fat? I have very Mixed Feelings so far.
Call Chelsea Peretti
Thrilling Adventure Hour
Comedy Bang Bang, major duh
James Bonding
Who Charted?
Dead Authors Podcast
You Talkin U2 To Me?, duh-to-infinity level
You know, I tried to listen to You Talkin U2 To Me? because Adam Scott is my favorite, but I couldn’t make it through a single episode. Maybe I haven’t listened to enough U2.
No way, the less you know about U2 the better. The appeal is Scott and Scott riffing on nonsense and doing countless side podcasts within the podcast (i.e. I Love Films) and then talking about the album for half an hour max.
I guess you have to have a high tolerability for Aukerman and his sense of humor. I love it but can totally see how it could be insufferable.
Crap — I already don’t have time to listen to all the podcasts I want to!
Criminal looks fascinating and they have ADORABLE little drawings, and the synopsis “What’s cropped up in rural North Carolina is essentially a Venus Flytrap crime ring” makes my heart sing.
I really like Wham Bam Pow, for important action/sci-fi movie conversations.
HELL YES CRIMINAL SOUNDS GREAT DOWNLOADING NOW!
I’m a stand-up fan and early podcast adopter so my podcast list is all of the comedy ones that have been around since 2006. Serial’s actually been the kick in the pants I need to get into some new stuff.
wow I am downloading this NOW
in other podcast news I have been really into Sawbones, Stuff You Missed in History Class, and Kumail Nanjiani’s X-files re-watch podcast
I love X-Files Files! Not only because I was and still am a gigungous X-Files dork (like it surprises me how much of the dialogue they talk about is still rattling around in my head), but also because Kumail is just so enthusiastic and adorable and clearly just loves the show to death. Plus a lot of the commentary is really smart.
Sawbones: A Marital Tour of Misguided Medicine
Stuff you Missed in History Class
Thinking Sideways
Sawbones is so great/appalling. I just listened to the Medical Cannibalism one which was exactly as advertised.
Ahhhh okay so a) that LA Review of Books review was AMAZING, I want to write love poetry to Mallory now, perhaps this weekend as I try to catch up with NaNoWriMo; and b) I just went back and read that Hairpin post on Villette and now I ALSO want to re-read Villette (which I read BECAUSE OF THAT HAIRPIN POST, ah, Vintage Pin memories) so
…does anyone wanna read/reread Villette with me?
Yes, desperately! But not until December because I’ll be exploding from stress until then.
I have never read Villette and I have been meaning to forever, so — yes!
I gave up halfway through! I could probably pick it up again.
The best line from that review:
“At least twice, Ortberg’s answer to the “how many male novelists” question involves the male novelists doing pushups: these shows of strength, like Gilmour’s tautologies, lift only themselves.”
OH SNAP
That birth story. Really great writing. I can’t tell if I’m more afraid of having a baby or never having a baby but I definitely feel anxious about SOMETHING.
It made me anxious about the birth I already had (that went a lot better than that) but what if somehow I’m not quite done yet and I have to spend 40 hours doing it oh god.
oh for sure. I went and got my uterus some herb tea from the witchy herb woman down the street and softly sang it lullabys all night.
Serial is awesome and so addictive (I want to know WHO actually killed Hae so much, none of the story holds together) but did you know there are awesome parodies of it? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6766EzEpZ1U&i…
My favorite part is the Mail Chimp part at the top because THAT KID WHO CAN’T PRONOUNCE CHIMP
that birth story really hits close to home for me (had an undesired c-section a little over two weeks ago) and now i’ve spent the last half hour crying while reading it. cathartic crying, though! i’m so happy the author wrote it and i’m looking forward to referring folks to her piece when they ask about my labor and delivery because everything in it is beautifully written and 100% correct.
Lanascrub! I have been thinking of you! Hope you and baby are doing well!
hey! i actually meant to email you and let you know that he finally arrived (9 days late, and very reluctantly), but time has gotten away from me a bit. I hope you’re doing well also and that these last few weeks won’t be too frustrating for you!
This was meant to be a reply! Trying again…
Oh man, that LARB review was so great. Like a soothing balm to the soul. I feel like “an imaginative space outside of male seriousness” is a great way to describe The Toast (though certainly not all-encompassing of all the things that make it so amazing and unique). And it got me thinking about why there are so many women who are responding to and delighting in semi-serious – or fully serious – misandry and rejecting the idea that we have to give any space up to male thoughts/opinions/needs or be friendly to men in our space. Personally I didn’t embrace it until I became a regular reader of the Toast; until I started doing things like making up misandrist lullabies in the comments or feeling comfortable saying things like “ban men”.
I think there are a few reasons why women are engaging with misandry in this way. I think Sarah Mesle gets it absolutely right when she observes that misandry and Mallory’s brand of satire are outlets for anger we can’t express “seriously” without usually getting silenced and dismissed. As Mesle observed the parameters of intellectualism and seriousness are set up by and favor men, so we are rejecting those parameters altogether – taking it to a place where we’re no longer on the defensive, and where men can no longer claim the high ground of logic/rationality/seriousness. Instead it’s now a joke they don’t get – we’re not on their playing field anymore, and we don’t have to prove anything because, hey, we’re not making a serious argument here anyway, right? It’s a joke they will never fully get because it is shaped by a uniquely female point of view that comes from having to live in and navigate a patriarchal world. It is fundamentally us carving out our own space and saying, guess what, we’re not gonna spend any more time and energy worrying about being seen as “man-hating”. If that’s what the world will call us regardless of how nice and friendly we try to be when we talk about feminism, we might as well fucking go with it and be proud.
And I also think it’s a reaction to just being absolutely tired of trying to ask nicely for our rights, our humanity, our voices to be heard and given the same weight as men’s. It’s exhausting being friendly and patient as we explain over and over why we should be treated like human beings, or try to come up with ironclad statistics-backed arguments for men who demand proof of our unequal status. It is absolutely absurd, in a world where women face the degree of violence and abuse we do, that we should have to feel obligated to qualify anything even mildly critical of men as a group with “not all men”. We are rejecting the idea that we have to be worried about your feelings in a world that is set up to favor you and disadvantage us.
Anyway, like Mesle I don’t want to ruin it through too much analysis, and I think in some ways I’m oversimplifying things. Regardless of the how or why this community and its ideas, jokes, wonder, sorrow, rage, laughter – and yes, seriousness – are a thing of beauty and a joy forever, and I’m so glad we’ve all come together in this little corner of the internet.
Yes, everything you said here is spot on. I am struck too by how easy it would be to replace “women” with “POC” and have it still ring true.
Your third paragraph is perfect. Perfect!
(not that the rest of it isn’t grand, just that that’s when the bells went *ding ding ding* for me)
I feel really uncomfortable about Serial. I’ve been listening (I’m caught up through week 6) because everyone’s raving about it, I think it’s technically well-done and clearly engaging, but… there’s something very off-putting about it, to me. I think my main problem with it is the way that the information is being parceled out to us, the viewer, makes it very uncomfortable for me (because all that I know about the case is being presented through Sarah Koenig’s perspective, and she’s not necessarily being honest with us — during week 6 she even said, “there’s been pieces I haven’t been telling you because they look bad for Adnan.”).
But to be fair, I think the way I feel about it is the same as I feel about TAL or Radiolab, which I can listen to once in a while but not consistently: it’s a story, it’s always going to be presented as a story, the story that we hear on the podcast or the radio is not the same as the truth, we’re only hearing the voices of the people who want to be heard, and they’re being crafted and manipulated by the way the team at Serial want us to hear them. I’ve caught too many errors in both TAL and Radiolab — little errors of just getting a fact or a date wrong, big errors of allowing the producers’ internalized biases to change the course of the story they’re telling — to be able to see it as journalism or any kind of truth. It’s not, it’s just a story they’re telling. And because this has real stakes, my enjoyment of hearing a well-told story pale.
I dunno, it’s not that different from how the information about the case is presented normally, even in court.
I respectfully disagree — in court you have prosecution and defense, where each is (ideally) convinced that their side is correct and true, and both sides have access to all the evidence before the beginning of the trial, and have the ability to cross-examine. Here we have a person with unknown biases (personally, I read her as being very sympathetic to Adnan, but that is my interpretation) revealing evidence to us as it fits the story she’s telling, questioning only what she thinks is questionable, accepting everything she thinks is right, leaving out what is convenient for her to leave out, and no one to cross-examine her interpretation. That’s not the same thing as a homicide detective would do, or a defense lawyer.
Your comment has actually helped me crystalize my opinion. I listened to six episodes, and I made up my mind: I personally don’t feel right listening to Serial anymore, because I feel like there isn’t a check on it the way there would be for a trial. That’s not to say people who listen to it or like it are wrong — as I pointed out before, I don’t really like TAL or Radiolab, which are also incredibly popular and most of my friends love them. It just means that this isn’t for me.
If Serial is not for you that’s totally valid, and I’m not trying to question that.
But, I will point out, respectfully, that the criminal justice system doesn’t always reveal everything. Yes, the adversarial system does mean that both sides are presented. But the rules of evidence and the limits imposed by the constitution (and tested by law enforcement) means that there is often tons of evidence that is never presented to the jury. So you are correct that the jury will hear from both sides, but it is very unlikely they will be privy to all the facts at issue.
I think Serial has done a good job of pointing out that prosecutors and Adnan’s defense attorney did not present cases that are correct or true, but cases that they thought would win. For example, the cell phone tower evidence. The prosecution totally ignored calls that didn’t match Jay’s description of where he and Adnan went that day and for some reason Adnan’s attorney didn’t call them out on this.
I don’t think the overall message of Serial will be that Sarah Koenig believes that Adnan is guilty or innocent. I think the takeaway is that the criminal justice system is seriously flawed.
Oof, that Post article.
“Not many months ago, my children and I sat in the sprawling living room of two black bankers in Rye, N.Y., who had brought together three dozen affluent African American parents and their children for a workshop on how to interact with law enforcement in their mostly white communities. Two police detectives and two criminal-court judges — all African American — provided practical suggestions on how to minimize the likelihood of the adolescents being profiled or mistakenly Tasered or shot by inexperienced security guards or police officers.”
Ugh jesus christ.
I can’t even respond intelligently to this, I am reduced to grunts and swears
It left my stomach churning; why, why, why hurl racial abuse at a defenceless CHILD (well, we know why, people are human garbage monsters) but worse, that it happened AT ALL.
I feel for those parents, I really, really do and I hate the fact that racism is a noxious, poisonous weed that keeps cropping up everywhere on this planet despite every effort to kill it.
I would love to post that article to my FB feed but I don’t know how to present it in a way so that the people who should read it might read it. Any ideas, Toasties?
Oof, I’m glad I didn’t read that birth story in my first pregnancy, because laboring forever and not progressing was my secret, deeply held anxiety. That was beautifully written and I hope amid all the emotions she catalogues she comes away feeling pride, because wow. She did incredible.
On a more flippant note, I love the blockquote. I gave labor pains an 8, ’cause I figured at 10 you’d pass out and at 9 you’d scream uncontrollably, right? So you have to leave some room? But does everyone leave room? What if no one else does and so my scale is entirely off?? Cue existential spiral: What even is reality!?!
I have never given birth, but when I went to emergency room after spilling boiling water on my leg, they asked me to rate my pain using a smiley (to sad to screamy) face scale. I found this utterly impenetrable. I was kind of in shock, so I just started laughing hysterically and babbling about how I skipped to the front of the line in front of all these bleeding and ill people just to look at a bunch of emoticons. I have no memory of which one I picked.
Ahh see I didn’t even THINK of the pain of boiling your own skin, now I have to totally re-assess my scale!
(J/K and I hope your leg is okay! I grant that medical professionals are probably just looking to assess your emotional state with regard to the pain so the absolute number doesn’t matter that much, but I have to imagine they get a lot of answers like yours.)
I was also unsure of how to rate my pain when I was in labor. I said something like, “Well it feels like a 10 right now, but I’m guessing it’s going to get worse, so I really don’t know how to answer.”
It also seems to me (from anecdotal evidence) that this is something women are more prone to do? Higher pain tolerance plus a totally different emotional/mental attitude about pain and empathy and imagination for higher pain. My mom recently had some horrendous eye surgery done and the doctor told her to call if the pain became unmanageable. She never did even though the pain made her throw up. I said, “i’m pretty sure that crosses the line to unmanageable” and she just said, “Well, I can imagine worse.”
yes totally a woman-thing, I think? or maybe I just associate it with women as I am a woman and I experience that problem with placing pain on a scale too. Like we can carry on while experiencing pain- we do that regularly with period pain anyway- so when it’s childbirth pain you go into survival mode I guess (having never given birth I imagine it is pretty terrible, but you just gotta keep going…also hormones are meant to kick in or something? I should probably read up on that)
I was once in A&E with terrible abdominal pain which they thought might be appendicitis but as it was at like 3am they didnt do a scan and just kept prodding me and asking me to rate the pain. Literal torture. I said maybe 9 but it was the worst pain I’d ever felt- because there’s always worse, but there hadn’t been for me til then!
Like we can carry on while experiencing pain- we do that regularly with period pain anyway-
Randomly noted and regarding the pain scale: the cramps I get with my period almost every month (sometimes I get lucky and start the Aleve/Tylenol pills before it hits which helps a LOT) are so painful that I didn’t realize I’d broken my ankle because “oh, it doesn’t hurt at all!” They said “no, look, it is broken, look at the swelling and the odd angle your foot is dangling” and I rated it a 3 or 4 on the pain scale. It did start to hurt more the next day, from the weight of the temporary plaster cast, but if I kept my foot elevated and didn’t try to move it around, it stopped hurting altogether (which is good, because I was allergic to the pain relievers they gave me and had to rely on extra strength ibuprofen).
I compare everything to my menstrual cramps for those pain scales and I had to have my orthopedist say “you know, having to grit your teeth to bear your back pain isn’t exactly a 2 on the pain scale” and “being unable to put weight on your right hip because it hurts isn’t a 5” – but seriously my seized-up back and funky hip never hurt like period cramps do and I’m still expected to work and drive and everything when cramping.
Omg I have a funky hip and back pain too! Just been rereading my (eventual, after 4 years) diagnosis randomly, and it’s like an a4 page long. but basically I have one leg longer than the other and didn’t realise for years because of BALLET but once i’d stopped all my ballet classes my hip got out of joint, and then I lost muscle strength and all downhill from there. Got lots of (fun) physio exercises now and am a lot better than I was a year ago- hope you’re improving too? what’s up with your funky hip?
About period pain- I added that in but thankfully don’t suffer from it (anymore) much myself. I recommend Cerazette for that, although very irregular periods (a long one then none or every few months) are the side effect- but no pain! yay!
BALLET!!!
That’s part of what fucked me up, too.
I’m hyperflexible but not so much so that I can do a pretzel, you know? But still enough that ballet exercises were exactly the opposite of what I needed to be doing, because now my joints are still all bendy and I can butterfly my knees while sitting and put my forehead on the ground but the ligaments or whatever don’t tighten up properly afterwards.
I don’t even know wtf is up with my hips. One orthopedist said it might be sacroilitis, because after sitting too long or walking too long (but especially walking/exercising/standing for too long), my hips get very very stiff and it’s painful to move my legs at all and it hurts to put weight on my right hip especially (so if I sit down, i have to lean to the left) and a few times it hurts enough to give out on me. I have a lot of extra motion in my hips that I shouldn’t at my age with my poor physical fitness, so the other orthopedist says it’s just lack of muscle definition. It does mean that sometimes my left leg is 1/2inch longer than the right, but only because my pelvis is rotated. And then when that happens my back muscles seize up and my head is literally three inches left of where it should be, and I have to do exercises to untwist my pelvis so my back calms down again.
But I had a spinal injection a few years ago that did wonders for all the pain! only it also gave me POTS, which finally mostly cleared up last spring (I still have tachycardia issues), and now the pain is coming back. so I’m trying to do my PT exercises again to help. I’m trying not to go back to the orthos, though, because they treat me like crap and blame me for my sedentary lifestyle, though at least half of it is depression.
I’ll have to look into Cerazette. I don’t mind irregular periods, because the pain is worse than anything. Thanks for the head’s up!
Ah we could be body twins! I have a dodgy right hip and sit on my left one more often too. If hips are outta line, it affects the cervical spine/neck the most it seems- have had 3-4 years of neck pain. Definitely lead to depression on and off, and am only now just getting treatment for the depression side of things. Hope you are too? (I;m 25 so it has got me down that my early twenties have been taken up with this shit)
I was actually told by this latest (and v good physio) that ballet helped keep my muscles strong around my hyperflexible (yup, same as you) joints and that stopping ballet or regular exercises meant the muscles couldnt hold me in place. Leg-length difference made it even harder for muscles to do their thing, and then the hip went and a donward spiral began.
My Advice: I would get a second opinion at least- I saw 10 people before being given a correct diagnosis. They were treating the pain and not the cause. You May have a leg length difference that is actually always present, as your hip could be ‘compressed’ and not just rotated- this is all from my experience so just a hypothesis. I was originally told I had no leg length difference but this latest Physio popped my right hip out and said I DO have one, and both hips were compressed to make it seem like legs were same length. I now have to wear orthoses to correct the difference- and my pain has decreased as a result, along with doing exercises.
My back also seizes up and neck rotates= must be due to hip/pelvic dodginess, and general hyperflexibility.
So atm I’m doing my exercises, drinking protein shakes (as need more working muscle to hold me up!) and looking into starting a dance class if possible (not ballet as need to wear trainers with my orthoses! lol)…..and CBT/ADs for depression. Recommend all or some of the above!
Sorry for rant I felt the need to reply speedily as this is crazy we are so similar in many ways!
Thanks for replying again 😀
Probably ballet was helping me, too, but I think of it more as a curse for making me work so hard to get more and more flexible so that now I can’t sustain it!
I got lots of x-rays and MRIs the years I was going to the ortho for my pain, and my pelvis is definitely distinctly rotated. It could be a leg-length thing causing the rotation, who even knows. But my last PT (who was superb and trusted me when I said something hurt or a new exercise left me in pain the next day) showed me ways to help it without manipulation, so I’ve mostly been doing that (and taking a muscle relaxer) when I feel it starting up, and it goes away pretty quickly now. It was costing me $80/visit to see him, because my insurance sucked, and I wasn’t getting much improvement anymore, so I “graduated” to do the exercises at home (except, of course, it’s a lot harder to be 100% about doing them at home when I don’t have the focus of the PT room).
But I refuse to be manipulated or anything remotely like chiropractory because when it was done to me when I was younger, it was fucking terrifying and I hate being held down, so I tense up, and I know that can’t be good for manipulating my bones. Plus, it never actually helped the pain. So unless it’s leftover from way back then, no worries there 🙂
My depression also is older than this pain, which I really started noticing when I worked in retail 8-9 years ago and would be practically unable to stand up out of my car after a 5 hour shift. I’ve had signs of depression since I was 7 or 8 years old, properly diagnosed since I was 12. 🙁 It’s been a long-term chronic thing, since I just turned 30 this year… actually, come to think of it, the SNRI I’ve been taking must have been helping the pain, too, but insurance is such a hassle to get it renewed right now I haven’t had it in 3 weeks. It’s technically not prescribed for depression in the USA, but for fibromyalgia. I happened to be participating in a clinical study for depression with exhaustion/sleepiness (versus the insomnia kind) and was lucky enough to get a drug that worked – and it just happened to be the study drug.
At this point, I’m working on getting more physically fit to help – starting with bike riding, because that’s also good for my tachycardia, and I’m working on quitting cokes as the first step to eating better. I eat way too many carbs and the carb-belly probably isn’t doing my back any favors, either. I need to find someone to go dancing with me – there’s a weekly swing dance session at a local whiskey bar that I know would be fun and good for me, but I need a friend to be accountable to 😀
(Of course, I’m in Florida, so.)
Oh and also- def see other physios/osteos for a different diagnosis, but DONT let them all click you about & manipulate your spine and neck (until you’re convinced they have given you a plausible diagnosis and treatment plan).
I let them all do their thing, and when I saw the final Physio he said I had been “over-manipulated” (lol, but actually not so lol) in certain areas of my spine, which was probably emphasising the hyperflexibility and making my spine rotate even more. Ugh it all gets so confusing!
I can recommend this physio but he’s in the UK- where are you based?
Oh, yes – this was also part of what my mom said about her nausea-inducing eye pain, “Well, I have had migraines that are worse” when we have experienced such pain on the regular and survived it puts everything in perspective, no?
YES.
And I think that’s the truth behind “women have higher pain tolerances”. It’s not that we don’t feel the pain, it’s that many of us suffer such extreme pain on a regular basis and are told that it’s “not that bad” that we assume that no, it isn’t that bad (or we act like it isn’t because otherwise we’re belittled or treated as useless).
Tangentially related, but my doctor actually assessed my asthma troubles as more severe than I reported they were (and he was right), because asthma sufferers get so used to breathing problems that they tend to under-rate how much trouble they’re actually having.
So, for those keeping score at home – chronic pain, chronic respiratory issues, and being socialized as a woman: these are things which interfere with an accurate diagnosis of physical suffering.
Who else is listening to Nicole’s Benedict playlist and finding it an AMAZING Friday work playlist?
(Also, I have decided today is a day to not think about Jian Ghomeshi — I have discussed and discussed rape culture, kink culture, personal experiences with Ghomeshi and sexual assault in general with everyone I know and I’m feeling completely burnt out from it. Time for music and puppies)
I had to go see an orthopedic surgeon once because I have compromised pain sensation in one of my feet, and it had suddenly puffed up to the size of a balloon and I had no idea why (turned out to be a hairline fracture), and every time, EVERY TIME, they still asked me to use the pain scale WHEN I LITERALLY PRETTY MUCH CANNOT FEEL PAIN AND I TOLD THEM THAT.
I would think that “swollen to the size of a balloon” would make the pain scale somewhat meaningless, but that’s probably why I’m not a doctor.
Whether or not it’s on purpose, I think it’s a really interesting parallel to how our criminal justice system works. People think that trials are just the facts, but they are just as much of a subjective narrative as this podcast–each side makes a story and whichever is more believable wins. There’s no such thing as just facts without story, and exposing that reality is a really interesting subject.
oops this was supposed to be a reply to stirringsofconsciousness!
Anybody here listening to The Read? It is a beautiful/hilarious/Beyonce podcast that focuses on gay and black culture, among other things, and I am OBSESSED.
I love the read! I would gleefully listen to a podcast devoted entirely to their imagining of Blue Ivy’s inner life.
Obligatory and deeply-felt UGH GHOMESHI but also UGH CORPORATE DRONES who knew and yet did nothing.
That LARB review is wonderful. If anyone ever wrote anything one third as nice about me, I would hand out copies to everyone I know, then happily take to the sea, knowing that I could do no more.
Also, Toast postcards have saved my sanity (twice!) over the past week. Coming home late on bad days to find them waiting has been a real, meaningful treat, so thank you!
Loved this bit in the review! “Spend enough time in this system, as a white dude particularly, and you come to believe in your own gravitas.
The symbolic association of manhood with seriousness — with Genius, with talent, with regard — has proved shockingly tenacious. Despite decades now of focused feminist critique, dudes still boom condescendingly at us. (Sometimes, they boom at us about feminism, which they feel uniquely able to explain!) Somehow the language of serious intellectual engagement has not been able to bring down the cult of Male Genius.”
We all need to try to change the association of Genius with Maleness. I have almost NEVER heard a friend or family member or professor say “She was a (real) genius”, but have often heard “He was a genius”. The goalposts of “this is genius stuff here” seem to be in a particular place for men to pass through more than women. Also my boyfriend always describes his friends as “he’s a really interesting guy” (he does have all-male friends though tbh) and that made me think I have NEVER heard a mutual friend who I am about to meet described as “a really interesting….girl/chick/woman”, but rather “She’s really cool/fun”. ‘Interesting’ goes with maleness too. Those two associations need to bite the dust!! GRRR
Women, instead, are called “bright.” As a dog or a child might be.
Serial is the best because it is basically Dirtbag Teen True Crime reporting on a 15 year old murder investigation.
The link to the LA Review of Books Review, before I clicked on the text of the full post, redirected me via google ads to a site trying to make me “volunteer abroad.” That was distressing.
I appreciate that this review is partly an actual review of this particular book Mallory has written, partly an ode to Mallory’s greatness in general, and partly an acknowledgment that men are, in fact, terrible.
Well-guessed! The giant helmet is from The Castle of Otranto, casual conversations with Satan feature in The Private Memoirs and Confessions of a Justified Sinner (among others), and the sexy evil nun (actually, a sexy evil woman disguised as a monk, but that seemed complicated) is from The Monk. Of these, I most heartily recommend reading The Castle of Otranto, because it has the best bonkers-shit-per-page ratio. The giant helmet is, like, page six.
< / evangelical love of my field >
Women, instead, are called "bright." As a dog or a child might be.
Three things about Serial: 1) I can't deal with the cute TAL-style title music. It's too whimsical for the story which is just…ugh sad and horrible. But I'm not sure what else I'd pick…you don't want grim-dark or creepy either. 2) It feels exploitative to me, voyeuristic. Like, I'm not sure I want to know these things about these people. 3) It is, however, totally frank about the subjective perspective aspect of the story. It's an anatomy of journalistic storytelling, because despite the obsessively evidence-based way she's going about it, Koenig knows (and says) that her own beliefs and desires are driving the show. In a way that's what the podcast is about: the fact that she can't keep her desire for Adnan to be innocent out of the investigation process. (This week's episode is fascinating on that level because you hear how a different group of people with a slightly different agenda and experience base interprets the same evidence.) And, yes, the courtroom situation gets compared to the storytelling situation a lot, and not to claim that either of them is a conduit for truth. It's all just narrative: what the lawyers said, what Koenig tells us, what the witnesses tell her, or tell themselves in their memory. It also produces this weird uncomfortable feeling when you find yourself responding to the story as if it were fictional, as if the end were going to be dictated by the requirements of fiction. It won't…but you know it will be shaped by storytelling imperatives somehow, and it makes you think about how your beliefs and opinions are shaped by narratives all the time. And not in a way that convinces you that's a good thing. Anyway I saw someone upthread worrying about how subjective the whole thing is and I just wanted to point out that yes, that's a feature not a bug.