North and South

by Mallory Ortberg · October 15, 2015

MR. HALE: my dear Margaret
I am afraid I have some bad news
I have resigned my post in the Church of England
I can no longer affirm its doctrine and we must leave our beloved home at once
I’m having a ghastly religious crisis that necessitates I uproot our entire family forever

MARGARET: my God
do you mean to say you have taken a new religion?

MR. HALE: not exactly

MARGARET: can you go into any detail about the crisis, to help me better understand?
have you lost your faith?

MR. HALE: it’s something much vaguer than that

MARGARET: but this is awful
it will change our entire lives forever
we will leave everything we have ever known and throw ourselves into economic uncertainty
can you at least give me a general outline of your problems with the Church?

MR. HALE: sorry no

MARGARET: are you an atheist? a Methodist? a Tractarian? a schismatic? a Baptist?

MR. HALE: don’t worry about it
just know that I cannot renew my vows, so we must move North and be unemployed

MARGARET: Can you…specify which doctrine?

MR. HALE: No
and in fact I will never be discussing my new beliefs again

MARGARET: Will you at least be following your conscience and preaching whatever doctrine you think soundest up North?

MR. HALE: I will not.
also I have not told any of this to your mother yet

MARGARET: what

MR. HALE: so if you could just do that for me
I would very much appreciate it
also if you could do it today because I’ve already sold the house and we’re leaving in two weeks
thank youuu

MR. THORNTON: hello

MARGARET: ugh
UGH
you smell of new money and PAVED STREETS
you look as if you have sold something to a shop recently
you look as if your father had a JOB
get out of here at once, you disgusting lump of coal

BESSY: halloo thar miss

MARGARET: ah that’s much better
you’re just poor, I’m perfectly comfortable around regular old poor people

BESSY: ai’m also dyin’, miss

MARGARET: better and better
that’s very proper, that you should be poor and dying
not like SOME people
not like some people who go to an OFFICE and then try to talk to LADIES with their OFFICE MOUTHS and their NEWSPAPER HANDS and their FACTORY EYELIDS
we are going to be best friends, Bessy

BESSY: [coughs]

MARGARET: I love you too, Bess

MARGARET: what is that
what are you doing
stop it at once

MR. THORNTON: I’m trying to shake hands with you

MARGARET: what kind of Northern strokery is this
begone

MRS. THORNTON: and how did you find Miss Hale

MR. THORNTON: I do not think she likes me very much, Mother

MRS. THORNTON: then I will set her on fire

MR. THORNTON: please do not set her on fire

MRS. THORNTON: I KNEW you were in love with her

MR. THORNTON: I don’t want you to set anyone on fire
that doesn’t mean I’m in love with everyone

MRS. THORNTON: but she is in love with you

MR. THORNTON: what makes you say that?

MRS. THORNTON: she didn’t let all those strikers murder you
what stronger proof do you need of her sluttery

MR. THORNTON: I don’t think that means she loves m–

MRS. THORNTON: I watch people get murdered in front of me every day
and I never do a damn thing about it

MARGARET: Mr. Thornton, I’d like to buy your factory

MR. THORNTON: THEN YOU DO LOVE ME

MARGARET: listen can I have your factory or not

MR. THORNTON: my factory and my heart as well

MARGARET: as long as I get the factory

Mallory is an Editor of The Toast.


159 Comments

  1. grandma_nancy +126

    “MARGARET: Can you…specify which doctrine?

    MR. HALE: No
    and in fact I will never be discussing my new beliefs again”

    GOD THIS MADE ME SO MAD I could not get over it. At least come up with a plausible justification for your weird novel-opening conflict, girl!

      1. Natushka +21

        This DROVE ME CRAZY when I first read it! Now I’m wondering if it might have been a sort of, “if you speak the doubt, it will spread, and you will be responsible” kind of thing. On both Mr Hale and Gaskell’s parts? As though doubt were a sort of communicable disease, so best cough into your handkerchief. And he is wishing heartily that he had never come down with such a nasty case of it. This is the most Victorian thing.

        1. Katy_Didnt +5

          I mean, Elizabeth Gaskell’s husband and father were both Unitarian ministers, so I don’t think she was necessarily wedded to CoE doctrine. My theory is pure laziness.

    3. prost +21

      I’ve noticed that I find it easier to be chill about this kind of thing in books written 150 years ago, because I assume that it’s just my lack of cultural knowledge and that readers of the time would totally get it (and then I never bother to do any research to disabuse myself of this idea). Similar thing for books in translation – I’m much more forgiving of stilted writing because I just assume it worked better in Swedish, or whatever. Whereas it’s written in English and set in a time and place I have directly experienced, I am way more critical.

      1. grandma_nancy +14

        Yeah at first I assumed there was some sort of subtle euphemism for some aspect of church doctrine that would have been obvious to her readers. And then I realized it was just terrible plotting

    4. Herberta +47

      I think I read somewhere that the historical background here is a purge of closet unitarians from the CofE clergy that happened at this time. However, I cannot for the life of me remember where I saw that information, so I may be remembering a discussion of another book entirely.

    5. Unreadaethel +66

      I assumed it was a comment on the legal and financial ability of men in 1850’s England to ruin everything for their families on the slightest of whims, without being required to justify themselves in any way.

  2. CNW +33

    Was watching Mallory’s livetweet of the miniseries the other day — hilarious, despite my disagreement with her on the merits of the movie/Richard Armitage (*swoon*).

    LOVED this:
    MARGARET: better and better
    that’s very proper, that you should be poor and dying
    not like SOME people
    not like some people who go to an OFFICE and then try to talk to LADIES with their OFFICE MOUTHS and their NEWSPAPER HANDS and their FACTORY EYELIDS
    we are going to be best friends, Bessy

    1. MunchletteBelle +103

      Does Mallory hold… low opinions on the merits of Richard Armitage?

      Because there’s a scene in that miniseries where he undoes his cravat after a long day of… something. And all of a sudden the hollow of his throat is exposed. I am pretty sure I had a second sexual awakening induced by the sight of that man’s collarbone. Is what I mean to say.

      1. malloryelis +34

        I wanted to KICK HIM IN HIS TEETH and I wanted Margaret to stay proud and aloof forever

        3. christinaemoss +49

          I feel like every character Richard Armitage plays has this truly frightening smoldering passion thing going on, which could either result in his declaring his undying love for you, or killing you, or both in turn. He’s super handsome, but there’s an edge to his characters that just doesn’t sit right with me and I’m never satisfied when the girl actually ends up with him.

          2. secondursula +5

            I didn’t know that! I think I trailed off the Vicar of Dibley in the wrong season, because I thought she ended up with Simon or the stick in the mud guy. Richard Armitage is much better, although yes, also terrifying.

          3. livingindialogue +14

            It was a series-ending holiday special, marketed in the U.S. as “A Holy Wholly Happy Ending,” and remarkably, Richard Armitage was romantic and gorgeous but _not_ alarmingly intense, just funny and sweet.

          5. livingindialogue +4

            Oh, me too! I was thinking of getting out the DVD, but I like your idea; I’ll just put it where I’ll be reminded to watch it when the holidays arrive.

          6. christinaemoss +10

            I forgot about Vicar of Dibley. I’ll grant you that one. But smoldering Richard Armitage reminds me too much of actually over the edge abusive Richard Armitage from Robin Hood.

          8. Unreadaethel +1

            I just watched those two episodes on Netflix, and when he talked about the sexiness of woman vicars, I experienced a sudden, brief call to ordained ministry.

      2. NotBob +27

        I call this the Cravat Effect, after this scene. It also occurs in that costume party episode of Miss Fisher’s… something something buttoned-up something something

        1. Roman +33

          It’s moments like that that make me actually understand why men might be undone at the sight of a lady’s *~*ankle~*~ Because…. DAMN SON.

      3. Scared_Vagina +89

        The last scene of that miniseries is possibly the most erotically charged thing I have ever watched I am deadly serious.

        1. hussified +10

          I may or may not have the YouTube clip of that ending in my favorites. And watch it several times a month.

        2. ThatOtherWench +6

          I don’t think anything will ever topple Sal and the bellhop,but this makes a strong case for “most erotically charged hetero moment”

      4. Unreadaethel +15

        Oh god, the hollow of the throat. I BURN, I PINE, I PERISH.

        But seriously, I want to lick him.

      5. evah42 +5

        And FOREARM exposure. This was where my forearm love was birthed. But it has to be rolled up sleeves, not t-shirt exposure. That’s just putting all the goods out in the display window.

      1. secondursula +30

        What!!! In my mind I did that thing where you sweep everything off the desk with a flourish: I am here for Patrick Stewart in anything, but especially this.

        ETA: Found it on youtube! Margaret’s accent is fehntastic. P. Stew. is handsome as ever. Thanks @Mrs_Peel, you’ve made my evening. 😀

        1. Mrs_Peel +3

          Yay!! Glad to be of service.

          I don’t think it’s all that well-known– I just happened to order it a few months ago from Amazon.uk, and I thought it was a great adaptation. And he’s fabulous (and very dashing), as always!

  3. bighairnoheart +101

    Literally all I know about this book is sexy Richard Armitage and also cotton? I’ve never seen the miniseries. This is what happens when I come across great literature that wasn’t an episode of Wishbone.

    1. MunchletteBelle +50

      …I have only seen the miniseries, but I am pretty sure those are the only two things you need to know. They are certainly all I took away from watching the miniseries. And I’m a little hazy on the cotton, though apparently breathing it makes you die. So, you know, avoid that if you can.

      2. Mrs_Peel +5

        I’m going to start wearing a face mask, just to make sure I don’t accidentally breathe any in.

      1. YoungLeafedJune +31

        I don’t think that guy ever plays characters who aren’t smug and morally righteous. On Lark Rise to Candleford he was some kind of socialist too and I believe he stood on a log and proclaimed things more than once, and then on Downton he’s always upbraiding Thomas for something or needling Anna about handling her rape improperly.

        1. Emma +2

          He was actually cast in Downton based on Julian Fellowes seeing him in North and South and creating the role in Downton just for him…

  4. bookwormV +7

    I need to reread North and South. This explains why I don’t really remember it making much sense.

  5. femaelstrom +102

    I….don’t think I realized North & South was a book. I thought the miniseries sprang into being, fully formed, as though from Zeus’s head, purely so I could be personally victimized by Richard Armitage and his office mouth.

    1. literarysara +58

      Richard Armitage’s office mouth curved in a perfect smile as he cups a country rose in his factory palm
      Richard Armitage’s office mouth murmuring “you’re coming home with me?” in wonder but also perfect satisfaction, like a cat
      Richard Armitage’s office open-mouth-kissing Margaret

    2. LadyJ +43

      We watched the miniseries after we’d read the novel in a Victorian Literature course made up of 5 girls and a guy. There was definitely a MOMENT when suddenly, every girl/professor in the room simultaneously realized just How Sexy Mr. Thornton was, and then felt slightly uncomfortable watching something so sexy for a class.
      And then at the end, when he meets her at the train station, and he’s all breathless and his Top Button is Unbuttoned? SEX

      1. Ganymede +20

        Just gonna have to say that this doesn’t happen in the novel. Especially not with the unbuttoned button, which would have been horrifically obscene in public at the time.

        HOWEVER, you do get, in a luxurious parlour, a phrase close to

        “…there followed a few moments of delicious silence”.

        I’ve always found that pretty bunk-worthy. Even before the Era of Armitage.

        1. Unreadaethel +13

          Especially since he’s just threatened to claim her in some strange, presumptuous way, and then dared her to kiss him.

          1. Nausikaa +3

            Seriously, who talks like that? Don’t get me wrong, I love love love this book, but there’s a lot of weirdly clumsy wording in it that you don’t see in, like, Mary Barton or Wives and Daughters.

          2. Unreadaethel +15

            But really, given John Thornton’s background, is it any wonder he’s super weird and awkward? His mother compared the love of eligible women his own age to a puff of smoke. He was never going to be a normal adult human being.

          3. Nausikaa +12

            That’s a good point. Also, are we to take it that he and his mother started out talking more like Higgins and trained themselves out of it? That might account for some of his awkwardness with language as well.

          4. Unreadaethel +6

            He and his mother started out resembling Higgins in a variety of ways, which is why their resentment is so strong, and also why they talk funny.

  6. thebeagee +11

    I feel…like I’m failing in some way. I have seen SO MANY people raving over the miniseries of this. Yet, I watched it and it barely made any impression on me. I don’t remember that much about what happened. I don’t remember being all that interested in where it was going. I just didn’t connect. I don’t understand, usually I’m all about this kind of cheese!

    1. depizan +18

      Although I loved the book, the miniseries was my least favorite of the adaptations based on Gaskell’s novels, Wives and Daughters is my absolute favorite. I mean I still enjoyed it, but it has a lot of flaws. Felt too rushed, they changed a lot, especially in characterization, like making Thornton more brooding and byronic (HE WASN’T). And some internal inconsistency created from their changes (like they keep that Margaret is supposedly a total slut for having hugged her brother on a train platform at night, but make out with Thornton on a platform in broad daylight, AND take a train ride alone with him afterwards AND be in a private compartment and that’s totally cool. Totally totally fine. No doubt Mama Thornton will welcome Margaret with open arms and warm bosom now.)

      1. christinaemoss +5

        Is he not brooding in the book? I could get behind that romance way more easily, then.

        1. depizan +18

          Nowhere near the extent he is in the miniseries. In the book, he prides himself on his even temper and manners. Whereas in the miniseries, he beats a man, and continues kicking him after the man is already on the ground. And goes around scowling, snapping at people and acting generally like a cranky ass.

      2. areed9b +4

        This probably won’t make a difference, but I discovered a couple years ago that the version on Netflix is actually shorter than the version on DVD. They pulled out some scenes for some reason. So maybe the DVD version would seem *slightly* less rushed and truncated to you?

        1. depizan +4

          No, I saw it when it first aired on PBS and have the DVD. Never saw it on Netflix. I feel like the end got fairly compressed and other side stories were dealt with too quickly. It would have benefited from the six hour treatment.

      3. ballisticjaguar +8

        I AM HERE FOR WIVES AND DAUGHTERS TALK.

        Sorry. I just. I love that miniseries (the book…I like but not as much as the miniseries).

        1. depizan +3

          Can we just talk about how perfect Justine Waddell is? Because she’s pretty damn perfect. And Roger, Roger I love with all my heart, but he’s such a dolt.

          1. ballisticjaguar +4

            She is perfect isn’t she! She is such a wonderful Molly. I also really love Michael Gambon as Squire Hamley. He fits that character so well.

            Have you watched Downton Abbey? Because Mr. Preston is in it playing a very similar character and I had so many instances of deja vu watching that second season. It was very weird and I kept wanting Mr. Preston to get back into his own story thank you very much (I don’t like him much in that either, but he should try to contain himself to one story. To be clear, I am talking about the character, not the actor of course)

          2. depizan +3

            I only saw the first season of Downton (which was plenty for me), so I missed his character. And Gambon is great. His grieving scene(s) so good. When people complain about his Dumbledore being too gruff, I’m like, but but Squire Hamley.

          3. ballisticjaguar +2

            yes yes yes. That is precisely my reaction to all Michael Gambon as Dumbledore talk.

            I only ever watched two seasons of Downton Abbey. The second ended with Mary and Matthew together and given what I’d heard of the rest of the seasons, that was enough to satisfy me. As far as I’m concerned, that show only has two seasons.

        2. Nausikaa +3

          I love the book so was prepared to be very critical of the miniseries, and I was totally pleasantly surprised by how much I liked it! Except for the ending which I thought was super generic, but when the author drops dead before providing you with an ending, what can you do? Also I thought it was a strange choice to give Lady Harriet a mullet. But aside from that I thought it was pretty much exactly what a miniseries should be.

          1. depizan +5

            Her short hairstyle was pretty popular in the early Regency, called a la Titus. By the time of Wives and Daughters in the 1820s it was mostly gone, but I think it had a very brief insurgence due to a popular myth called Le Bal des Victimes, where supposedly family members who had relatives killed by guillotine would hold dance parties in the cemeteries and would cut their hair short in solidarity.

  7. falcofield +57

    I love this series, love it with all my gross heart. But Margaret’s whole fucking family is the worst, ESPECIALLY DIXON (who’s definitely got more than a little crush on lame old Mrs. Hale, right?). Thorntons rule!

    1. Roman +30

      But can we talk about how this is one of the few books I’ve come across where the effects of sending your child away from home to be raised by another family are really shown in the parent/child relationship? I don’t think it’s addressed so much in the miniseries, but in the book it’s all about how Margaret just wants to be, like, important to her mother but she never can because she was raised by her cousin. It’s so sad! Even though, let’s be real, her parents are kind of shitheads who don’t necessarily deserve her adoration.

      1. AliJaye +3

        I wonder if this was something specific to Gaskell, because I remember in the miniseries of Wives and Daughters, Cynthia is remarking on how her mother sent her away when she was basically a toddler and how they’re not close now. She says something like, “I can’t forgive her for sending me away when I would have clung to her.” But I can’t remember if that part is in the book or just the mini-series.

      1. Jessa +6

        I totally agree! Dixon is madly in love with Mrs. Hale, and all three non-Margaret Hales are the worst! The way pouty Mrs. Hale pressures Margaret into inviting Frederick to come home, and then everyone just lets Margaret wrack herself with guilt about the danger Frederick is in, despite the fact that horrid Mrs. Hale made her ask him to come!

  8. middlemarch +35

    “what stronger proof do you need of her sluttery” –> I will be using this phrase on the regular now.

      1. typewriterandgramophone +7

        “I polluted the environment with my factory so it aggravated her consumption.”

        Sorry about the pop-up-filled link, by the way- the original page seems to have been taken down. 🙁

      1. cuminafterall +72

        It has to do with the difference between purchasing power and economic power– someone with 18,000 GBP in 1855 might have been able to buy 1.5 million GBP worth of stuff in today’s dollars, but they had the same influence over the economy as someone with 45 million GBP in today’s dollars, because the economy overall was relatively smaller.

        (This is how I’m using my International Relations degree, sorry Mom)

        I see my link didn’t quite work– maybe this one will?

        2. secondursula +25

          Daaaaanng, just ran the numbers mentioned for Bingley’s income at the beginning of Pride and Prejudice and he was sitting on an annual income with a historic standard of living value of £262,200 and an economic power value £15,970,000. Between this and the tab I have open for the 1975 adaptation of North and South I feel like a kid in a candy store!

  14. jenvega +68

    Mr. Thornton: You took a brick for me it must mean YOU LOVE ME
    Margaret: OMG IT WAS JUST BASIC HUMAN DECENCY DO YOU HAVE SO LITTLE OF THAT UP NORTH HERE?
    Mr. Thornton: You have as good as publicly declared YOU LOVE ME so marry me?
    Margaret: I REFUSE TO LIVE WITH YOU IN YOUR SNOW-WHITE HELL

    1. Unreadaethel +11

      Mr. Thornton: But you saved my life MARRY ME
      Margaret: But seriously, I told you that if you didn’t rush out to confront an angry, starving mob it was because you’re a coward, so really, you need to CHILL OUT about the love thing.

  15. Zueignung +51

    Yes, Richard Armitage, but that ending in the miniseries is ridiculous! Full-on making-out at a train station would not happen–at least wait until you’re in the car. Otherwise, as Lady Bracknell says, they would be exposed to “comment on the platform” and possibly worse. Sluttery indeed!

      3. Unreadaethel +24

        And he’s not even wearing a cravat! Or jacket! His neck is just all naked in front of God and everybody!

    2. poordrunkandhungry +74

      okay so it was anachronistic as hell, but also very hot, and we all know what trumps what in period romance films.

    3. ThatOtherWench +35

      A third or more of the unnecessary romance-preventing conflict was just everyone being super scandalized that she was *near* a man boarding a train!

    4. AliJaye +3

      I always feel bad for Henry in that scene. Yes, he was a bit jerkish (he’s nicer in the book) but he looked just crushed in that scene and do you really have to make out in front of him, Margaret? He’s helping you try and get Frederick’s case reversed!

  16. nicole_44 +25

    Mildly embarrassed, as I always vaguely assumed this was about the American Civil War. Welp.

    1. goonerkate +38

      There’s a North and South about the Civil War, too! It’s a series with Patrick Swayze. I know because I accidentally rented it when I meant to rent this North and South and it was very confusing.

    2. wildemoose +15

      Don’t be, there is actually another completely different miniseries called North and South based on the novel by John Jakes, and that one IS about the Civil War.

    3. GinnyQ +10

      In your defense, there was also a miniseries about the American Civil War, also called North and South. It starred Patrick Swayze and Kirstie Alley, among other ’80s stars. It was probably the same amount of ridiculous melodrama. I consider it to be a Civil War soap opera. My mother loved it in the ’80s, and showed it to me when I was at an impressionable age, and I, too, loved it. And every time someone talks about North and South (including clicking on this article), I hope they’re talking about *my* North and South and not the silly British version. And I am always disappointed.
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_and_South_(mi…

      1. S +9

        I wound up with a copy of the Civil War version when I had asked for the British one, but I watched it anyway, and my lord, I enjoyed it. Masculine friendship! Sweeping drama! Southern accents! Patrick Swayze’s hair!

      2. bighairnoheart +7

        Adding on to this by saying that little me loved that miniseries. Just absolutely adored it. While current history major me really can’t stand much about the period, the Civil War was my main jam when I was a small child.

      3. Mrs_Peel +14

        Mildly fun nerd fact: Jonathan Frakes (of Star Trek TNG fame) met his wife Genie Francis (a.k.a., Laura from General Hospital) while making this, and they’re still happily married.

        1. GinnyQ +2

          I did not know that he was married to Laura from General Hospital (which my mom also watched, so I got the full ’80s soap education, haha)! This is an amazing fun nerd fact! Thanks!

  17. myownprivatenetherfield +34

    SO GOOD

    Though I never realized before how close Pemberley was to the hideous industry of the North, how perfect dreadful for the Darcys.

  18. alula_auburn +28

    ” I don’t want you to set anyone on fire
    that doesn’t mean I’m in love with everyone”——->is relevant to my interests.

  19. PotterPotterson +5

    I watched the mini-series with a bunch of people via rabb.it, and as a result, I feel like this article perfectly sums it up for me. You know, thanks to all the distractions.

    I maaaay have wanted to punch Richard Armitage in the face at some point.

  20. ppyajunebug +120

    YOU CAN PRY THAT TRAIN SCENE FROM MY COLD, DEAD HANDS

    WHAT DO YOU PEOPLE HAVE AGAINST PERIOD CLOTHING!RICHARD ARMITAGE LOOKING AT HER ~LIKE THAT~?????

    6. HashtagHashbrowns +14

      If I need a happy sigh in my life, I re-watch the last 20 minutes of N&S and just stare at Richard Armitage and his unbuttoned shirt and face of intense longing. Also this gif is making me twitterpated.

    8. Unreadaethel +5

      I’m reading this post again at work, and I feel so many kinds of inappropriate right now.

  21. merrite +33

    Regardless of the Armitage factor, Mr. Thornton really makes one reconsider one’s previous aversion to Bolshevism.

  22. madgeylou +40

    The Hobbit travesties have ruined Richard Armitage for me, I’m afraid. All I can see when I look at him is Thorin Oakenshield with his Beyonce hair blowing in the wind outside Bilbo’s front door. Stop trying to make sexy dwarves happen, Peter Jackson!

      1. kashicat +1

        Oh yes. Oh yes. I swung heavily back and forth between Thorin and Kili throughout all three movies. Yum.

    3. pairofbuttons +9

      For me that was the proof of his powers – that all that makeup and nonsense couldn’t ruin him forever. I respect that your experience was different.

      1. kashicat +2

        Those hobbits were what made me a Richard Armitage fan. All the rest is wondrous treasure to discover now, but that’s where my deep, sincere love began.:-)

        1. pairofbuttons +1

          mind=blown, gravity is backwards, dogs walking upright like men, earth rotates the other way now

          What I’m saying is this confused me.

  23. Squishalicious +20

    There is nothing I don’t love about this post, especially, “I watch people get murdered in front of me every day and I never do a damn thing about it.”
    I stopped reading the book once I got to Bess coughing and wishing for death in that awful phonetically spelled accent and Margaret responding without any phonetic changes to her language about God preferring her to live in misery blah blah blah.
    I fed heartily on the miniseries, though.

    1. Nausikaa +5

      I actually really like Gaskell’s use of dialect. I don’t know if it’s accurate or not, but it at least reads to me like it could be accurate, and I find it pretty easy to follow given that in some ways it’s a different language from the one Margaret is speaking.

      1. Eli +8

        It’s apparently super accurate–her husband the Unitarian minister was heavily involved in Manchester dialect studies. Which doesn’t at all eliminate the patronising element, just means it’s also scholarly. They’ve opened up Mrs Gaskell’s old house in Manchester now, and they’ve got fantastically keen docents. There’s even a display of an Indian shawl Elizabeth had, just like the one Margaret is having draped over her in the opening passage.

        1. Squishalicious +2

          Now I know! Perhaps it will give me the fortitude to pick up the book where I left off. Without that knowledge, I felt like Bess was being framed more like a pet/curiosity/symbol than a person.

  24. redheadedwolf +14

    MRS. THORNTON: I watch people get murdered in front of me every day
    and I never do a damn thing about it
    I haven’t read this book, but I think I love her.

    (psssst, I guess my indifference toward Richard Armitrage AND Mr. Darcy is the final proof of my lesbian nature)

  25. Nausikaa +37

    I love this book but man did I get sick of Margaret’s rich white throat and rounded white arms and white taper fingers and billowing white silk dress like a cheese and pure maidenly modesty.

    Also, at a certain point, killing off every single person Margaret cares about stops being tragic and starts being ridiculous. Bessy dying – okay, that had to happen. The mom dying – fine, that’s an important part of the story. The dad is a bit of a stretch, though, and by the time we get to Mr. Bell, you are just straight up murdering people so Margaret can inherit their money.

    1. Eli +13

      I actually laughed at Mr Hale dying: Oh how lovely he’s gone for a nice relaxing visit to Oxford oh wait he’s dead.

      Bess’ non-stop high-concetration morbidity was also pretty comical.

    2. Jessa +9

      I really appreciate that the miniseries just had Mr. Bell move to Argentina. The mortality rate of “people who know Margaret” nearly equals that of “people who have come in contact with Lady Mary’s death vagina.”

    1. jahphotogal +1

      I wrote some really good NS fanfic back in the day – it might still be available at C19…

      2. Unreadaethel +1

        Who are you on C19, and are you one of the writers who’s written PM-only adult scenes?

  28. Evelyn Woods +6

    When I discovered this miniseries, I was surprised that Richard Armitage was that hot, because I will always think of him as deranged, greasy Guy of Gisbourne flinging open doors and menacing everyone as he slowly goes of he rails in the terrible (but wonderful) BBC Robin Hood from 2007.

  29. hjw2707 +1

    Brilliant! Just brilliant! And ppyajunebug and I will obviously be wrestling for the train scene, despite it being quite ridiculous… 😉

  31. revengeofpompom +6

    I just watched this! And unless I missed something crucial, the Mr. Bates subplot proceeded thusly:
    Nicholas Higgins / Mr. Bates: You fools CAN’T work for this rich dude! We must hold fast to the strike or die — LITERALLY DIE, THAT’S RIGHT — trying!
    *time passes*
    *time passes*
    Mr. Higgins-Bates (sotto voce): Man, it hard getting by without a job…
    *time passes*
    Mr. Higgins / Bates: I shall work for you again, evil mill-owner, but only because I have gotten to now you on a personal level and realize you are Kind Of A Nice Guy. And thus my principles remain untarnished, due to this little-known exception to the moral code!
    FIN

    1. Unreadaethel +2

      Bates: Also, you’re in love with my dead daughter’s best friend/benefactress, so you’re probably not entirely evil!

  32. carnationcat +2

    I have just stumbled across a group of the wittiest people on the Web! LOL-ed my way all the way down the page, and the original post was funny enough. =D

  36. lady_peter +5

    I waited patiently to a) finish the book and b) watch the miniseries before reading this post and THANK YOU IT WAS SO WORTH IT.